Speaking of hating people…

I hate religious dickheads who try to make the rest of us follow their insane rules.

Why am I so pissed? Because I just read this story (pasted below).

DENVER — A Senate committee split along party lines to kill a proposal Monday that would have banned most abortions in Colorado.

The proposal (Senate Bill 143), modeled after one passed in South Dakota last year but later rejected by voters, would have banned abortions except to save the life of the mother and in cases of incest, rape and a medical emergency.

The Senate Judiciary Committee voted 4-3 to kill the measure, with all Democrats voting against it and all Republicans for it.

Sen. Bob Bacon, D-Fort Collins, said he remembered classmates dying because of illegal abortions performed with coat hangers and knitting needles and didn’t want to return to those days. After hearing from women who said they suffered from depression, substance abuse and troubled relationships following abortions, Sen. John Morse, D-Colorado Springs, said the right to choose, even if it turns out to be the wrong decision, should be left to the individual.

“Please don’t take the opportunity to make those choices from me and think you can do it better because you’re the government,” Morse said.

Renfroe, who pledged to introduce a ban during the campaign, told lawmakers abortion is “the civil rights issue of our generation.”

I’d heard of this a few weeks ago, but figured with our new Democratic gov’t in Colorado, it had no chance to pass. It still pissses me off completely that these misogynistic assholes have even enough power to bring this up as a topic of discussion. It makes me want to kick them in the teeth. I’m not a violent person, but sometimes I just can’t help thinking that without violence, no real change ever happens. Would the civil rights movement have made any progress with MLK Jr. and no Malcom X? Would slavery have ever ended without the Civil War? I would like to say, “yes” but I really don’t think so.

Well, I know I’m supposed to write about books, but this really pushed me over the edge. Thank goodness for the “Religious Rants” category on this blog, or else I’d have posted this on my knitting blog. Maybe I will anyway….


P.S. Because a commenter feels that I am endorsing violence, I am adding this note:

I’m not advocating violence, just feeling frustrated and thinking about what really causes change. I’d like to think peaceful resistance yields results, but I’m not quite convinced. I’m pretty much a pacifist, but sometimes I do wonder whether I am being ridiculously idealistic.


Donna Druchunas is a freelance technical writer and editor and a knitwear designer. When she's not working, she blogs, studies Lithuanian, reads science and sci-fi books, mouths off on atheist forums, and checks her email every three minutes. (She does that when she's working, too.) Although she loves to chat, she can't keep an IM program open or she'd never get anything else done.

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  1. These types of bills are introduced all the time. State legislature staff get thousands of draft requests from legislators. The majority of these never get to committee let alone get out of committee…

    As for power, introducing bills is the main job of a legislator. It's what they've been elected to do. However, the bill has to make it out of drafting, then out of committee, then out of whichever chamber of the legislature it started, then into the other chamber for additional vetting, then out to the governor to sign into law. It's designed to mitigate the potential for badly written laws making into statute. However, it doesn't prevent badly written laws from making it into statute…

    Having worked for two different state agencies in Montana and Colorado writing what are called "fiscal notes" to describe the potential impact of legislation on an agency, I can honestly say that this bill doesn't even come close to some the wackiest or scariest stuff that I've seen such as eliminating all public education or outlawing the public display of "human male genitals in a discernibly turgid state, even if completely and opaquely covered." (See

    And finally, violence does beget change but it alters everyone – victim, offender, and society – for the worse. If you really want change, get involved. Participate in government or learn how to lobby rather than advocating violence. The best type of change comes from education and knowledge. Shining a light on ignorant thinking exposes it for what it is. After all, isn't that what the Skepchicks are all about?

  2. Well, I'm not advocating violence, just feeling frustrated and thinking about what really causes change. I'd like to think peaceful resistance yields results, but I'm not quite convinced. I'm pretty much a pacifist, but sometimes I do wonder whether I am being ridiculously idealistic.

    At any rate, I do what I can here and on my other blogs and by talking to people I meet one on one. But for the most part, everytime I have tried to get involved in a political campaign or activist organization, they want me to stuff envelopes or spend hours calling other people who have said they'd volunteer, so they can come in and stuff envelopes. Which I consider a huge waste of my time.


  3. I'm honestly not sure I agree with this. I think "educating" people has its limits, and when people forcibly try and take your rights away, force is necessary. I can stand on a mountain top and "educate" people all I like, but when they beat me up when I try and enter a clinic to exercise my right, I have the right to respond. Obviously violence is not a great answer, but the great movements of our time have NOT been without violence.

  4. Hih… Ummm… I may advocate violence. No alot…. just like that slap tothe back of the head that hurts like the dickens.

    yeah I said dickens. I'm 80 at heart.

  5. violence in the form of killing doctors and bombing clinics seems to be OK in some camps :(

    I am always perplexed when Christians do things like that in "the name of God." They clearly read a different book than I did. Probably the same one all the people who sent me death threats for teaching evolution read.

    I remember acting as a clinic guard in North Carolina when Ralph Reed was just beginning to get press (1988ish). He yelled a lot of hateful things at me.

    It's really scary that he's become such a powerful politico.

  6. I know you're not advocating anything of the sort, but I dislike militancy, because it attracts idiots, however there is a battle of ideas. It annoys me that a lot of the people who talk about liberty to practice religion, and believe in things without evidence, are so keen on restricting the freedom of others. They're hypocrites of the worst kind, they want special status because of their religious beliefs, but believe anyone that doesn't share those beliefs should have their liberty restricted. E.g. you're free as long as you agree with us.

    While sceptics say you're free, but if you're going to impose your views on others you'd better have evidence. Essentially sceptics are pro-freedom. We're not going to go around imposing our views on other people unless there is evidence, and even then, only if they present their views as fact.

    If you want to get really angry watch the following:

    Admittedly it's a very contrived television show, but should writing "Nascar sucks" and "Country and Western is Rubbish" on the side of your car prompt such a response? Freedom indeed. Although I dare say they could get a similar response with different slogans in rougher parts of the UK.

  7. I don't think Top Gear does play in the US (maybe on BBC America), it's kind of a knee-jerk show in a way, it's not particularly conservative but the main presented (Jeremy Clarkson, the tall guy) pretty much makes his living saying controversial things. Although how much of it is irony is open to debate. It's the number one car show in the UK and has been going in various forms for a long time now.

    The shows are often uploaded to YouTube though.

  8. See? This is why I insist that the human race is doomed. These redneck, trailer trash hicks are breeding like rodents, while people with two or more brain cells have few or no children. They outnumber us, and so they chose our leaders who further undermine any intelligent, rational thought.

    I'm with bug girl. Now I'm depressed, too. :(

    Violence doesn't ultimately work because the government – the root of the problem – controls the police and armed forces. Vaguely reminiscent of the Roman Emperors … So one can "get active" and educate the voters and hope some of it sinks in, but you can only vote for those on the ballot, who are the only people rich enough to run! I really didn't care for John Kerry at all. I voted for him because he ran on the Anybody-but-Bush ticket. When your electoral process is finding the lesser of two evils, you know there's a problem.

    Yep. Doomed I tells ya!

  9. Great comments. I was watching the second airing of the Paula Zahn segment about atheists being persecuted last night. The thing that really gets me about the Christians (those represented in the media, anyway) is that they just don't GET freedom.

    They think, because Atheists don't want to have Christianity shoved in our faces all the time, that we are against their freedome to be Christian. That is, their Christianity REQUIRES them to be shoving their shit in our faces all the time. If they are prohibited from coercing others and spreading their hate speech about gays, etc., then they feel that their rights are being violated.

    However, it is not OK for those of us who are NOT Christians to boldly voice our views against religion, because, again, that means we are stepping on their rights.

    The hypocricy of their position would be laughable if it weren't so frightening because they have political power.

  10. So the message is: People in hicksville Alabama will pelt you with rocks and chase you out of state if you say something they don't like.

    How is this NOT a stereotype we'd already heard of long ago?

    I guess at least now we know it's actually TRUE …

  11. exarch, is that comment regarding the video clip? If not, you will have to clarify because I have no idea what you're talking about.

  12. writerdd… the thing that got me about the second segment on Zahns horrible show is that the thing that generated the "hate' mail (their panel being a bunch of skunks) was not adressed at all…. they only talked about the "news" story, which they replayed.

    It was sad… and blood boiling.

  13. …except to save the life of the mother and in cases of incest, rape and a medical emergency.

    It's interesting which exceptions anti-choicers have to add to these bills to try to get middle-of-the road types to go along with them. Sometimes they even include "contraceptive failure" as an allowable exception. Kind of like, "well, you were trying, so we'll give you a do-over."

    It seems like the one class of people they really want to punish are these irresponsible sluts who carelessly go out and get themselves pregnant without thinking about the consequences. Punish them with motherhood. Like these are the kind of people they want to become parents.

  14. See? This is why I insist that the human race is doomed. These redneck, trailer trash hicks are breeding like rodents, while people with two or more brain cells have few or no children. They outnumber us, and so they chose our leaders who further undermine any intelligent, rational thought.

    I’m with bug girl. Now I’m depressed, too.

    I think you're with Francis Galton, actually. He argued that birth control would lead to a reduction in intelligence, because intelligent people would choose to limit their reproduction and we'd be overrun by hyperfecund idiots. He was assuming that intelligence was hereditary. I don't know about you, but I don't make that assumption.

  15. Speaking of which (dumb people reproducing more than brainy folks), has anyone seen the movie Idiocracy?

    Dumb, but funny. I guess it fits into the "college humor" genre. I thought probably would get bored and turn it off halfway through, but I ended up laughing off and on all through to the end.

  16. What's up with calling funny-'cause-it's-dumb movies "college humor"? For me, college was the first time I could hang out with a whole crowd of people who would laugh at a joke out of Nabokov or paraphrase a passage of Voltaire as an impromptu dissection of some absurd bigotry. Movies like Road Trip were what we watched in high school, dammit.

  17. It's not that intelligence is heredetary, but good parenting probably is (and so is bad parenting, and stupidity).

    If the person who raised you told you a load of bullshit, you're going to grow up believing a load of bullshit. Particularly when you have no reason to doubt the bullshit, and everyone around you believes the same load of bullshit.

    It's not a genetic problem, it's a social one …

  18. It’s not a genetic problem, it’s a social one …

    Exactly. So let's not worry about who's having the babies, but who's educating them.

  19. >What’s up with calling funny-’cause-it’s-dumb movies “college humor”?

    I dunno. Actually my husband said that and it seems like they market these kinds of movies to college students. Plus it kind of reminds me of those movies where college students are the main characters. At any rate, I watched this movie in my 40s. So the difference between high school and college age is negligible to me at this point. I know it's a huge difference when you are 16 or 20 or 24.

    The movie was funny, but I agree with the comment above that the problem is with the educational system, not with who is having more babies. That's why I think the libertarians are being ridiculously stupid when they suppor things like the "religious bill of rights" that allows people to opt their children out of classes that don't support their religious beliefs, and when they say all schools should be private so every partent can choose what their children learn. That is a recipe for disaster on an individual, a societal, and an economic level. The way we maintain a common culture in America is by having a common educational system for our children. Unfortunately we are so self-centered that we can't seem to have the nerve to get advice from the examples of other countries with better school systems than we have, because that would require us to admit, at least on a small level, that maybe we're not the world's greatest nation after all.

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