My friend Louise recently came across a Twitter page (and website hawking a book) dedicated to ENDING RAPE! Actually ending it. Declaring itself the best resource anywhere in the world.

And how does ENDING RAPE suggest we end rape? BY NEVER COMING INTO CONTACT WITH MEN. Ever. Anywhere. Unless we already know them. BUT DON’T GET TO KNOW THEM BECAUSE STRANGERS ARE RAPISTS. And also people you know are rapists. Ending Rape has offered an endless list of shitty advice that basically boils down to FEAR EVERYTHING ALWAYS… and hide in the bushes. (No, ACTUALLY hide in the bushes.)

The sad thing about Ending Rape is that this is advice that society finds totally reasonable. If you are NOT following any of these tips, you kind of put yourself in the position to be raped. I mean, you’re not ASKING for it… but you’re still at least a little to blame. You really did, even if accidentally, imply that you wanted to be raped. Why WERE you outside at night alone? Why did you answer the door for a stranger? Why did you leave your glass unattended? Why did you wear that skirt? Why were you out with a man you didn’t know? What were you doing in that part of town? WHY DIDN’T YOU TRY HARDER NOT TO GET RAPED? You can’t just EXPECT men not to rape you… at least that’s what self-proclaimed victim advocate Ending Rape claims.

Here’s some of my favorite excerpts.

Why is “don’t rape” so much harder than expecting women not to live in constant fear? Why can’t we just expect not to get raped? What is with all the bushes weirdness? What CAN women do that’s not setting them up for rape?

The Afternoon Inquisition (or AI) is a question posed to you, the Skepchick community. Look for it to appear Sundays, Tuesdays and Thursdays at 3pm ET.

Featured image via here

Elyse

Elyse

Elyse MoFo Anders is the bad ass behind forming the Women Thinking, inc and the superhero who launched the Hug Me! I'm Vaccinated campaign as well as podcaster emeritus, writer, slacktivist extraordinaire, cancer survivor and sometimes runs marathons for charity. You probably think she's awesome so you follow her on twitter.

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63 Comments

  1. Profile photo of SpiralArchitect
    May 7, 2013 at 4:44 pm —

    Based on this series of “logic”, Elyse and I should not be married. The fact that we are is an abomination against everything this clown college stands for.

    Although, I believe we have found a possible new product line: Bush Hazards!

    • Profile photo of Giliell
      May 7, 2013 at 5:37 pm —

      Actually, how did we ever manage to really get to know those guys without getting raped by them before we made it into the magical “no rape danger” zone?
      But I’m really a Bad Girl™ anyway who asked to be raped by going to work tonight, so what do I know?

  2. Profile photo of Moniqa Aylin
    May 7, 2013 at 4:51 pm —

    Are we SURE this isn’t a continuation of #SafetyTipsForLadies? They all read about the same to me. At least I can feel certain that I will one day be raped for working in an office, leaving my house, living in a house, opening windows, dating men, etc. ad infinitum.

  3. Profile photo of porlob
    May 7, 2013 at 5:19 pm —

    These tips are useless for “ending rape,” though some of these tips may have some utility for “getting rapists to rape someone else, at the cost of anything approaching a normal life.”

    This victim-blaming bullshit is a “parody.” Right? It HAS to be… Please tell me it is.

    • Profile photo of criticaldragon1177
      May 8, 2013 at 12:18 am —

      Porlob,

      Unfortunately, I don’t think this is parody.

      • Profile photo of happyapple
        May 8, 2013 at 9:40 pm —

        I don’t think it’s a parody, but I do think it blatently stole most of those ‘tips’ from one of those stupid “how to protect yourself from crime” lists that police departments like to give out. Thus the tips about the credit card statements and the bushes, which are ‘tips’ for preventing completely different crimes. Trimming bushes back around your house & windows is so your nosy neighbors can see if someone is breaking into your house while you are away. Nothing to do with someone breaking in to rape you. Hiding behind a non-trimmed back bush to break in a window is still pretty damn visible to anyone on the inside of the window.

        • Profile photo of Doug Ducat
          May 12, 2013 at 8:04 pm —

          Yeah, it’s like they missed the point of half of their regurgitated crime prevention advice. Several of those “tips” almost make sense, but in a totally different context.

  4. Profile photo of donboc
    May 7, 2013 at 5:28 pm —

    Many of these suggestions are clearly laughably ridiculous. On the other hand, isn’t it possible to give prudent advice without blaming a victim? I mean, I’d advise people not to walk down dark streets counting the bills in their wallet. That doesn’t mean that if someone does this and is robbed, it’s the money-counter’s fault. People shouldn’t mug other people. But I do try to avoid certain activities because, much as I wish there were no one who wanted to mug me out there, I have first-hand experience that there indeed are people who want to mug folks out there, so I try to avoid putting myself in positions where the probability of mugging might be higher. I don’t hide in bushes, and women shouldn’t either. But staying in well-lit areas when possible and avoiding being alone with men they don’t know very well seem like sensible things to do, no?

    • Profile photo of Elyse
      May 7, 2013 at 5:38 pm —

      Because there’s actually things you can do that will make men less likely to think it’s okay to just stick his dick up inside you? What are the things that women do that trigger rapes? You know, like how when someone sees money and they’re totally desperate, they might grab it… so if someone is like REALLY horny and you’re wearing a skirt? Or being drunk within 3 blocks of a porn shop?

      • Profile photo of donboc
        May 7, 2013 at 5:52 pm —

        Don’t more rapes happen in alleys or on dates than in libraries? I don’t know that this is true but I suspect it is. I’m not saying women should spend all their time in libraries. But getting blacked out drunk and going home with a guy that a woman doesn’t know very well probably puts a woman at greater risk of being raped. If she does this and IS raped, it’s not her fault; it’s the man’s fault, of course. She deserves zero blame for it. At the same time, she has engaged in an activity that doesn’t minimize the probability of being raped….

        A few months ago, a friend of mine was murdered by a man who came to do some contract work on her house. It was a horrible tragedy. It was his fault, not her fault. I hope he spends the rest of his life in prison, and I hope it’s not a very happy life. At the same time, I advised my sister not to have (cable/utility/exterminator) men come into her house when she’s alone there. This advice I gave her is, frankly, probably a little silly, since it’s almost completely unheard of for people in the service industry to murder their clients. But rape isn’t unheard of — aren’t something like 20-25% of women sexually assaulted by age 30? I just don’t see it as victim-blaming to tell young women that if they get blacked-out drunk to the point that they don’t know whom they’re going home with, they’re going to be more at risk of various bad things happening, including rape.

        • Profile photo of Elyse
          May 7, 2013 at 6:01 pm —

          Women do get raped in libraries. And get raped far more often in their own homes, by people they know and trust than in alleys. In fact, Google rape+library= About 75,700,000 results; rape+alley=About 5,560,000 results. Obviously not scientific or definitive proof, but it is telling that people are talking about libraries and rapes 15 times more than alley rapes.

          But that’s okay. I have an iPad with a Kindle app. I only have to worry about my husband.

          • Profile photo of donboc
            May 7, 2013 at 6:08 pm

            Interesting about the google results!

          • Profile photo of MarlowePI
            May 7, 2013 at 7:12 pm

            Well, obviously this means that women shouldn’t learn how to read, if they want to avoid being raped.

        • Profile photo of marilove
          May 7, 2013 at 7:00 pm —

          I don’t know that this is true but I suspect it is.

          You “suspect” it’st rue. I see. Suspect. Why didn’t you GOOGLE?! It’s not that hard. Here:

          http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/sexual-assault-offenders

          Approximately 2/3 of rapes were committed by someone known to the victim.1
          73% of sexual assaults were perpetrated by a non-stranger.1
          38% of rapists are a friend or acquaintance.1
          28% are an intimate.1
          7% are a relative.1

          Now kindly stop “suspecting”. Or rather: STOP making wild, incorrect, stupid assumptions.

          • Profile photo of donboc
            May 7, 2013 at 9:32 pm

            And how is that related to what I wrote? I wrote that I suspect that more rapes happen in alleys or on dates than in libraries. You wrote that victims often know their assailant. Non-sequitur.

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 7, 2013 at 10:09 pm

            I missed the “on dates”. I don’t think most women know the attackers from alleys. Appologies.

        • Profile photo of marilove
          May 7, 2013 at 7:11 pm —

          I advised my sister not to have (cable/utility/exterminator) men come into her house when she’s alone there.

          Huh. So what happens if you live alone? I live alone. I have for the majority of my adult life. And sometimes, I have to let OMG MEN!!!! into my home, and sometimes I’m the only one home. Gasp. Oh dear.

          “At the same time” is really just an overly-long phrase for BUT!

          It was a horrible tragedy. It was his fault, not her fault. ….[BUT]….I advised my sister not to have (cable/utility/exterminator) men come into her house when she’s alone there.[and my random friend-of-a-friend would probably be alive if she hadn’t.]

          So, question: How long until I can determine when a man is no longer maybe a rape threat? 10 minutes? 10 days? A year? How long ’til he and I can hang out without my having to bring along a chaperon? Do you get to decide this? Or do I?

          One time in the middle of summer IN PHOENIX, my air conditioner broke. It quickly climbed up to 90+ degrees in my apartment. It was after 10pm. I called the apartment complex. It was hot as fuck, so I was wearing shorts and a tank top (and no bra, oh my!!). The “maintenance” guy who came up was actually not the maintenance guy, but rather the manager’s son. He harassed me, though thankfully it was fairly minor, and the REAL maintenance guy came up shortly later and was really nice and apologetic.

          If I had been assaulted, would it have been my fault for 1)daring to live alone as a woman (gasp!) and 2)daring to call to get my a/c repaired in the (oh no!) middle of the night, while I was alllll alone?

          Oh, I know what you’ll say: “Oh, you know, it wasn’t your fault, BUT! you shouldn’t live alone. You need to have a chaperon at ALL TIMES!”

          Right? Because that’s really what you’re saying. Because *where* the fuck does it start?

          If I live alone, I can’t open my door to strangers, but! I also have to trim my bushes. Shit, I guess I have to get a MAN! to do it, because my little lady (cable/utility/exterminator) men come into her house when she’s alone there.

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 7, 2013 at 7:12 pm

            Poop, enter too soon, this is why I always do it in word. To finish my thought and erase the accidental paste:

            Shit, I guess I have to get a MAN! to do it, because my little lady vagina can’t seem to exist without a man by hers side. But he can’t be a stranger! I must know him “well enough”, although I’m not totally sure what “well enough means”. And since most rapists know their victims, I GUESS I am just fucked and should just kill myself.

          • Profile photo of donboc
            May 7, 2013 at 9:45 pm

            You wrote, “Oh, I know what you’ll say: “Oh, you know, it wasn’t your fault, BUT! you shouldn’t live alone. You need to have a chaperon at ALL TIMES!””

            No, that’s not what I’ll say. Kindly stop saying what I’ll say. Or rather: STOP making wild, incorrect, stupid assumptions.

            I don’t think that women shouldn’t live alone. And, yes, the risk of being murdered by a service professional is small, I’m aware of this. My friend who was murdered lived alone. I don’t think she was wrong for living alone. It’s a scary world we live in where a young woman full of life and doing nothing wrong can open the door to let in a man to do some work and be dead 10 minutes later. I’m angry that this happened. She was one of the best human beings I’ve ever known, and was ended by a depraved man in the blink of an eye (a man with no prior record, no way for the company that employed him to have known that he was a dangerous person). This is scary, and I think my sister is generally safer if she has another person with her when strange men come into the house. I recognize that this is sometimes impractical or impossible, and I recognize that service people rarely act violently against clients and so when people do have to let people in while alone, they are not at great risk.

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 7, 2013 at 10:21 pm

            So your friend lives alone and yet you advise her to not allow people inter home while alone?
            I am SO TIRED of, “isn’t it possibleto give women advice without blaming the victim?” Bullshit.
            Every time the subject of victim blaming and rape culture comes up. EVERY FUCKING TIME. And then we yet again get tired and impossible and constantly repeated and patronizing advice about not going g out after dark or staying alert or not getting drunk and may you shouldn’t do that and i promise I don’t think it was the victims fault but how we did she know the guy anyway and was she drinking?
            Like women don’t know this shit and already. Please.

            You have said NOTHJNG NEW

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 7, 2013 at 10:22 pm

            This is not a site for mobile browsers.

          • Profile photo of donboc
            May 7, 2013 at 10:32 pm

            WTF are you talking about?

            “So your friend lives alone and yet you advise her to not allow people inter home while alone?”

            No, my friend lived alone. Now she’s dead. I advised my sister not to allow strange men into her home while alone.
            I wish my friend had had the man come over while a friend was there. Probably, if that had happened, they’d either both be dead or, far more probably, they’d both be alive. The friend wouldn’t have to be a man. This didn’t happen. I know that most of the time when a person lets a stranger into his/her home, he/she doesn’t die, but I still think people are generally safer with friends/partners than alone.

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 7, 2013 at 10:37 pm

            Ah. So she is dead because she lives alone or because she invited a man over while alone?

            that is what we call victim blaming.

            Apologies for the, uh, hilarious typos. Hit enter again too soon. Kindle keyboard sucks.

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 7, 2013 at 10:40 pm

            It is just interesting that the focus is 100% on your friend, the victim. The murderer is mentioned almost in passing.

          • Profile photo of donboc
            May 7, 2013 at 10:53 pm

            You’re being really insensitive regarding a very painful subject to me. I’m not blaming my friend. I’m sad that she’s dead. You’re putting words in my mouth. Please stop doing so.

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 7, 2013 at 11:48 pm

            You were the one that brought it up. There are other survivors here. Women. including me. You realize that, right? Do you think you’re being sensitive by repeating the same victim blaming questions? Because you’re not.

            Is it a SURPRISE to you that this is a painful subject? Once again, you make it all about you! And your anecdote. Derailing ftw.

            This isn’t a hypothetical situation for most of us. Glad you’re finally getting THAT much, at least.

            And I’ve not put words into your mouth. Saying that doesn’t make it true.

          • Profile photo of donboc
            May 8, 2013 at 1:11 am

            I don’t know what your point is about the murderer being mentioned in passing. He’s a piece of shit. My friend did nothing wrong. She had a great, productive morning, woke up early to walk her dog, had a meeting with her boss in the morning, stopped by Walgreens on the way home, met with the service guy at her front door, and was dead and her body on fire 10 minutes later. How am I supposed to focus on the murderer? He’s an awful human being. He shouldn’t have done what he did. He’ll probably be locked up for the remainder of his days.

            If certain circumstances had been different, she might still be alive. One of those circumstances of course is if the guy who showed up at her door hadn’t been a no-good piece-of-shit asswipe. Unfortunately, we live in a world that is populated by some no-good piece-of-shit asswipes. Another circumstance that could have been different is if my friend had had a friend with her that day. Unfortunately, this isn’t always possible. I wish we didn’t live in a world where having a friend with us makes us safer from assholes. But we do and saying that people who say this are blaming victims doesn’t make it so.

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 8, 2013 at 3:32 am

            You seem to get none of the points. Im sorry your friend died, I really am, but you keep hanging on to your personal anecdotes as of they prove that women who have chaperones will be safer and we are straight up telling you it is a BULLSHIT.

            So, enough derailing about YOUR experiences.

        • Profile photo of onamission5
          May 7, 2013 at 7:23 pm —

          If a young women gets black-out drunk, and the guys present know better than to rape her, they will not rape her. Let’s leave the responsibility for self-policing behavior in the hands of the responsible parties: those who commit criminal acts of violence against others. Advising women and girls to avoid perfectly legal behaviors and activities has never and will never stop rapists from raping. All it does is increase the odds they will rape the other women instead of you and make women and girls have to behave like prisoners in their own skin lest someone blame them for the crimes committed against them.

    • Profile photo of Giliell
      May 7, 2013 at 5:40 pm —

      Not that shit again.
      Because, you know, there is acually no real correlation let alone causation between those things. Staying in well-lit areas is fucking useless when the person most likely to rape you is your current or former intimate partner or your date or an acquaintance.
      Statistically speaking, dark alleyways are fucking safe.

    • Profile photo of porlob
      May 7, 2013 at 5:46 pm —

      Comparing living a normal life (going to bars, jogging, engaging in chit chat with people at the bus stop) to counting hundred dollar bills whilst walking down a dark alley is pretty ridiculous.
      Sure, there’s nothing intrinsically wrong with prudent advice. But the advice given to women to avoid rape (of which this is typical) ranges from glaringly patronizing (Do you need a book to tell you not to count your hundreds in an alleyway? Why is it okay in the case of rape avoidance?) to outrageously restrictive. And it has 2 bonus effects: Making victims feel responsible when they are assaulted; and of being actively being counterproductive towards “ending rape” by establishing situations where rapists will feel emboldened to rape because, really, she was just asking for it.
      Ultimately, if the author claims to be working to “end rape,” telling victims that that wouldn’t have had this problem if their skirt were a couple inches longer is 100% counterproductive.

      • Profile photo of Elyse
        May 7, 2013 at 5:50 pm —

        Literally the best advice for avoiding rape is don’t date, don’t have friends, don’t have family members and don’t ever be around anyone who is consuming alcohol. Because those are the things that are most likely to get you raped. In real life. By a long shot.

      • Profile photo of donboc
        May 7, 2013 at 6:07 pm —

        Yes, I agree with you porlob, well put.

        When I was mugged, I wasn’t counting hundreds. (If I were to count the bills in my wallet, I wouldn’t be counting hundreds!) I was walking down a dark street at 2am, when a guy came up behind me and asked me if he could have a dollar because he was trying to get something to eat. I slowed down to take out the money from my pocket and he pushed me against a fence and told me to give him everything (which I did). I now would not handle that situation the same way. I’d try to avoid walking down dark streets late at night. If I need to do this, I walk briskly and am very aware of my surroundings. I no longer have any fear of looking ridiculous running — it might look weird to start running just because someone’s near me (on a dark street late at night), but I’d rather look silly than get mugged. I’d offer this advice to anyone, and I don’t think I’d be emboldening muggers or justifying their behavior.

        That said, I agree that the outrageously restrictive suggestions are absurd.

        • Profile photo of marilove
          May 7, 2013 at 7:20 pm —

          One time I was walking alone to the bus stop in the middle of winter, at 5am. It was very, very dark; not yet dawn. I was walking down a quiet side-street. A truck pulled up slowly behind me. This was during the time of The Baseline Killer, and I lived in pretty much the same neighborhood, so my senses here TINGLING. He stopped right next to me and said, “Hey baby, wanna ride?” I couldn’t see inside. I screamed “FUCK OFF!” as loud as I could, and I ran to the thankfully near bus stop, which also thankfully already had a couple other people waiting.

          Again, thankfully, not a huge deal, but scary as shit.

          But you know, I was alone, walking in central Phoenix, when a known murderer and rapist on the loose (seriously, google him). But since YOU wouldn’t walk around alone at night, I guess I asked for it. Except, but! Wait, you’ll say you totally think I have a right to walk where I please. Except you just said….Hmmm. This is getting quite circular, isn’t it? Weird, huh?

          I’d try to avoid walking down dark streets late at night. If I need to do this, I walk briskly and am very aware of my surroundings. I no longer have any fear of looking ridiculous running — it might look weird to start running just because someone’s near me (on a dark street late at night),

          HAHAHAHA. Welcome to the world of women every day. It’s cute that you NOW do all this.

          Newsflash, buddy: Women do it every fucking day of their lives, since they are very, very young..

          That said, I agree that the outrageously restrictive suggestions are absurd.

          Then stop making them! And stop acting as if you’re one random and rather non-eventful mugging is somehow comparable to getting raped on the streets. And also stop talking as if getting raped in an alley way is the biggest threat a woman faces because it’s not. I’m really tired of this focus. YES WOMEN SOMETIMES GET RAPED IN ALLEY WAYS. We know this because every fucking time rape is brought up, we have to go through THIS exact conversation. EVERY tiiime.

          I am so tired of it. SIGH!

          • Profile photo of Blakut
            May 8, 2013 at 6:12 am

            Do you carry a gun?

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 8, 2013 at 11:32 am

            Nope. Never have. I almost bought one many years ago for cheap from a cop friend of mine but still couldn’t afford the $150 good-friend price, nor the self defense classes I would have to take so I knew how to USE the gum in HIGH STRESS situations.

            Do you think guns are free? Do you think people are safer AUTOMATICALLY by holding one?

            Because the answer to both questions is no.

            I also hate such questions because it implies that women SHOULD have guns. If they don’t, its their fault they are dead! Even tho studies tend to show a gun is not necessarily going to save your life. It probably will kill you if your assailant gets it.

            Your question is stupid.

            And I am far from anti gun.

          • Profile photo of Blakut
            May 8, 2013 at 9:05 pm

            My question is not stupid. My question implies nothing. There are also less than lethal alternatives. I’m a man and always carried pepperspray in my country. Never used it on people but on a pack of stray dogs in the city attacking someone.

          • Profile photo of Blakut
            May 8, 2013 at 9:07 pm

            Have you also realized that you are the top commenter of this site and that you are attacking someone in the majority of your posts?

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 9, 2013 at 12:02 am

            So why DID you ask me if I carried a gun? How was that AT ALL irrelevant to the discussion ,if you *weren’t* trying to imply that it was a way to protect myself? Can you explain to me why? I’ll politely wait. I don’t think I”m wrong, but maybe you’ll surprise me! I’ll give you that chance.

            I won’t even bother with your question, because I don’t give a fuck.

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 9, 2013 at 12:05 am

            Also, no shit there are non lethal alternatives! Do you think that women have never been told to carry pepper spray before? Or guns? Or to take self-defense classes? WHY are you trying to tell me HOW to protect myself, when we are having a discussion on victim blaming and rape culture?

            I’ve already mentioned that the same shit gets mentioned over and over and over again whenever the discussion of rape culture or victim blaming comes up.

            BINGO! Times two, actually: Guns and pepper spray.

            Why do you think guns or pepper spray are at all relevant to this discussion?

            Hint: They aren’t. Even a little bit. ‘Cuz, honey, we already know about the non-lethal options. Care to try again? Maybe this time you’ll say something new.

          • Profile photo of Blakut
            May 9, 2013 at 5:41 am

            What about those who are not yet victims or survivors of attacks? Shouldn’t we encourage people to be careful???

          • Profile photo of marilove
            May 9, 2013 at 12:43 pm

            You didn’t answer even ONE question I asked! Instead, you just answered my questions with yet another victim-blaming question of your own.

            Let’s take these two questions together:

            “Do you carry a gun?”

            “Shouldn’t we encourage people to be careful???”

            Nice condescending use of multiple questions marks, too, buddy!

            What, do you think women ARE NOT careful every day of our lives, or something? Do you think women exist in a world in which they don’t already realize we must be careful? Do you think it’s NEWS to us that it’s a dangerous world to exist in as a woman?!?!?!?!?!

            So, what’s your advice, hmmm? What’s your “encouragement” to women “to be careful”? And how does it correlate to guns?

            And why do you think carrying a gun is “being careful”? Again, do you think guns are free? Do you think every person who owns a gun automatically knows how to use one? Do you think every person who owns a gun automatically knows how to use one IN A HIGH STRESS SITUATION?

            Do you think every person is willing to shoot another human, even if that other human is attacking them? Because guns are made to kill. Not every person is willing to kill another human being, for any reason. Even if for self defense. Or maybe they aren’t able to pull the trigger. Because that shit is not easy. You know that, right? Shooting another human being is not easy. So why do people pretend it is?

            What if someone doesn’t want to OWN a gun? Is it their fault they are attacked? SHOULD someone own a gun? SHOULD someone be willing to kill another human?

            That’s what that simple “Do you carry a gun?” question implies.

            Are you a person who believes EVERY person, including woman, SHOULD own a gun to protect themselves? Because that *strongly* implies that if a person -such as a woman- does not carry a gun to protect themselves as you believe they SHOULD, it is their fault that they were raped or are dead because they were not carrying a gun as you think they should.

            That is exactly what such a question “Do you carry a gun?” implies when we are discussing victim blaming and rape culture.

            Again, WHY IS IT that whenever the subject of RAPE CULTURE and VICTIM BLAMING come up the same fucking “advice” is thrown around as if it is new to us?!?!

            Why do you think “Do you carry a gun”? is in any way appropriate in a conversation about victim blaming and rape culture?

            And lol, again, at the notion that women aren’t already careful. Two men already! TWO! have made that assumption — t hat women are too stupid to realize that they live in a dangerous world.

            You know, I used to work as a detention officer, and I grew up around guns and around cops.

            I know very, very, very well how attackers think and act and how many drugs they are on.

            Do you know what the BEST advice is? The advice that will likely save your ass more than anything else? More than carrying a gun you may not be able or willing to use when the moment comes? Or pepper spray that may not do shit to your PCP’d or meth’d up assailant?

            MOTHERFUCKING RUN! Get the fuck out of there. Don’t try to attack your attacker — get the fuck away.

            That’s what you should try FIRST. The very first thing. Not shoot. Not spray. RUN.

        • Profile photo of onamission5
          May 7, 2013 at 7:27 pm —

          An elderly woman across the street from my house was mugged in broad daylight at 7:30 in the morning at a bus stop in front of witnesses. What would your anti-mugging advice be for her? Whatever it is, I have better advice: Hey muggers, stop mugging people.

          • Profile photo of Moniqa Aylin
            May 8, 2013 at 10:37 am

            Uh, OBVIOUSLY, don’t be old.

    • Profile photo of marilove
      May 7, 2013 at 6:57 pm —

      On the other hand, isn’t it possible to give prudent advice without blaming a victim? I mean, I’d advise people not to walk down dark streets counting the bills in their wallet. That doesn’t mean that if someone does this and is robbed, it’s the money-counter’s fault.

      —-

      I’m a HUMAN BEING, not a wad of money.

  5. Profile photo of porlob
    May 7, 2013 at 5:29 pm —

    Yikes. The table of contents and excerpts form the book are sickening: http://aworldwithoutrape.org/experts-book-cd-dvd.htm
    How can we achieve “a world without rape?” Answer: get a dog, and never engage in conversation with anyone.
    The author, Richard Hart, is a master of patronizing horseshit. This all amounts to “Don’t talk to strangers. Don’t tell people that your daddy — erm, husband — isn’t home. Come straight home from school.”
    Except, you know, aimed at capable, responsible adults.

  6. Profile photo of marilove
    May 7, 2013 at 10:25 pm —

    I promise I am not drunk. Yet. At this point, I might as well. Fuck yeah I have Jameson.

  7. Profile photo of criticaldragon1177
    May 8, 2013 at 12:17 am —

    Elyse

    Truth is women or men for that matter should have to live in fear of getting raped. I think everyone here will agree with that. However, I think some of “ending rape’s” suggestions go a bit too far.

  8. Profile photo of knitty
    May 8, 2013 at 1:06 am —

    Is it just me. Or are we going backwards? Kurt Cobain would be spinning in his grave.

  9. Profile photo of Buzz Parsec
    May 8, 2013 at 1:28 am —

    “Hide in the bushes. You can’t get raped in the bushes. Bushes have a special forcefield around them that electrocutes anyone who walks near them while thinking “I wonder if there’s anyone in this bush I can rape.”

    But only well trimmed bushes… which we’ve already discussed.”

    No good. If you read the quickie yesterday about ticks, you’ll know that if you hide under a bush, you’ll get Lyme disease, spotted fever and dozens of other dreadful diseases. And it’s all your fault for not taking reasonable precautions like never leaving the safety of your kitchen.

    • Profile photo of Elvismorte
      May 8, 2013 at 8:18 pm —

      Buzz, I don’t want to alarm you but this morning in my KITCHEN, I leaned down to pet my cat and when I stood back up I hit my head on the cabinet that SOMEONE (me) had left open. I AM NEVER GOING IN MY KITCHEN AGAIN. Also, I think my cat is trying to kill me.

      • Profile photo of marilove
        May 9, 2013 at 1:01 pm —

        my computer chair back is very high especially when i’m not sitting in it straight. One night I had a sweater swung over it. I was leaning over looking at my computer, and when I looked to the left … I thought the chair/sweater was a person. I screeched. It was hilarious. I was like wtf, man?

        And I’m not easily spooked, haha.

        • Profile photo of Buzz Parsec
          May 9, 2013 at 3:05 pm —

          Of course your cat is trying to kill you. It’s a cat. Kitchens are also trying to kill you. Fires, razor-sharp knives, pots of boiling water, not to mention the deadly food. Never go into a kitchen, especially if there’s a cat, especially if you are barefoot. (I was recently diagnosed with diabetes and my doctor told me not to walk around barefoot.) Fortunately, I’m genetically incapable of getting pregnant, at least with current technology, so I don’t have that danger to contend with. (According to the CIA, the US is 136th of 183 countries in maternal mortality rate, at 21 maternal deaths per 100,000 live births. Most of western Europe is included in the 47 countries doing better than the US and are in the single digits.)

  10. Profile photo of punchdrunk
    May 8, 2013 at 7:12 am —

    Donboc, you’re telling women that they’re imprudent to order a pizza or speak to the apartment manager without calling someone to come over. That they’re taking risks every morning when they walk to the bus stop without a chaperone. That their friends and family should hold their hand as they go about their daily life.
    Do you take the day off work and go over every time your sister gets a package, every time the landlord sends a handyman over, do you walk her to work every day?
    Can you understand why that’s insulting? We can’t leave our femaleness out of sight, we don’t ‘take it out and flash it around in dark alleys’. Existing isn’t a behavior that needs to be modified.
    I’m sorry about your friend, but that can’t justify all women living in fear. I have to live my life. Without a chaperone or a burka to keep the bad men away. Treated like an adult human being.
    I hope you’re well, and if not, I hope you have someone to talk to about your grief and fear.

    • Profile photo of Moniqa Aylin
      May 8, 2013 at 10:39 am —

      *Insert snarky remark about how effective requiring women be chaperoned is, based on rates of violence against women in cultures that do.*

  11. Profile photo of James Fox
    May 8, 2013 at 12:40 pm —

    My 19 year old daughter is currently living in Italy working as an au pair and studying violin. She’s been having a wonderful time and she’s been on a few dates with Italian guys. Before she went we talked about being aware of cultural differences and general safety stuff but I didn’t want to make her feel like it was more dangerous in Italy than it was at home because statistically there’s no real difference. She’s adventurous and I don’t want to dampen that by filling her head with notions that she is one or two bad decisions away from being raped whenever she’s out with friends or acquaintances. Her parents have taught her that some guys are truly moronic asses and one of the best life tools she can have is being a good communicator and having the skills to see how other people react to her having opinions and being an assertive independent thinking person. There are no guarantees in life but I know my daughter has no tolerance for guys who don’t respect women or who are in any way controlling; and hopefully she can identify those traits in guys who are trying to be charming. Last week when I was skyping with her she said she was done with dating Italian guys because it seemed like they mostly assumed that because she was from the US she wanted to have lots of sex with many guys. I seriously doubt that any of the macho Italian guys she’s met want to rape my daughter any more than her guy friends here in liberal western Washington. So the notion of telling her to stay in some kind of isolated safety box sans shrubbery and not live life is pathetic, and as Elyse and others have said the problem is in the mind of the rapist and asking my daughter to live in fear solves nothing.

  12. Profile photo of nomaduk
    May 9, 2013 at 10:43 am —

    Anyone want to beat Tesco up for perpetuating this sort of crap?

    Sign the petition here.

  13. Profile photo of marilove
    May 9, 2013 at 12:46 pm —

    Hey laaadies. I just want to encourage you to be safe! To protect yourself!

    Do you carry pepper spray? What about a gun?

    There. So much encouragement! And what novel, new advice, amiright? So great. My advice is so awesome. I hope it ENCOURAGES you to be safe. :D

    • Profile photo of Dave Kinard
      May 11, 2013 at 9:32 pm —

      A different way to put it: The reason the “reasonable” advice is insulting/aggravating is because by taking these suggestion, you are submitting to the oppression. So there’s the danger of violence, but also the fear that then restricts your freedom. By letting that fear control your actions and limit your freedom, you’re not preventing yourself from becoming a victim, you ARE becoming a victim. It’s the same as telling a black person “well, we know you shouldn’t be harrassed by the cops, but you know practically, if you want to avoid that, it would be a good idea to stay out of rich white neighborhoods.

  14. Profile photo of Dave Kinard
    May 11, 2013 at 9:31 pm —

    A different way to put it: The reason the “reasonable” advice is insulting/aggravating is because by taking these suggestion, you are submitting to the oppression. So there’s the danger of violence, but also the fear that then restricts your freedom. By letting that fear control your actions and limit your freedom, you’re not preventing yourself from becoming a victim, you ARE becoming a victim. It’s the same as telling a black person “well, we know you shouldn’t be harrassed by the cops, but you know practically, if you want to avoid that, it would be a good idea to stay out of rich white neighborhoods.

  15. Profile photo of Melanie Victoria
    May 13, 2013 at 12:53 pm —

    Whoever created this ending rape account clearly has no knowledge of gender issues and/or criminology. I find it absurd that rather than the continuance/ intensification of our efforts to discourage men from being rapists or severely punishing those who are, we have a long list of precautions women must take in order to prevent rape. Using the principle of parsimony, the most elegant way to deal with the problem is to STOP THE RAPISTS. In spite of all this advice (which many women take very seriously) a woman can do everything properly and still be raped. The most sensible approach to rape prevention is: severe punishment for rapists, discouraging men from committing rape by increasing their awareness of consent/power dynamics and promoting a culture of equality between the sexes where the female sex is respected rather than denigrated. Of course, some will argue that this approach leaves the crux of power solely in the hands of men. My rebuttal is that a woman is free to follow all of the “don’t get raped advice” in the world. However, ethnographic studies have proven time and time again that in cultures where women are respected and valued (the more egalitarian cultures), the rape rate is far lower than in cultures which are more patriarchal. I doubt the women in those more egalitarian cultures are following reams and reams of “don’t get raped advice.” Men (for the most part) respect the women in those cultures and choose not to rape them.

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