Afternoon Inquisition

AI: More like AfGAYnistan

Today the US Military’s policy of “Don’t Ask Don’t Tell” was repealed. Before DADT, gays were not allowed in the military. DADT made it so that no one was allowed to ask you if you were gay… and as long as you didn’t mention that you were gay, you could serve.

Basically, gays were still not allowed, but as long as you agreed to live a lie, you can serve… and live it convincingly, because you didn’t want to be outed… because “don’t tell” meant “don’t let on in any way”.

But today, America has made the decision that gay people are just as good at protecting our country as everyone else… they’re at least as good as atheists anyway.

Well, now that Teh Gayz are no longer STFUing and now have the ability to TAKE OVER OUR MILITARY, Conservapedia is ready to defend it… defend the military… from the military… by updating webpages. But what’s important is that they’re ready to fight (by which I mean “type”) from their couches:

Liberal Senator Joe Lieberman: “We’ve got the votes” to repeal “don’t ask, don’t tell,” which would turn the military over to the homosexual agenda. [7] Notice how the Senate is doing this after the election, and not before?

What do you think the Homosexual Agenda’s first order of business will be? What do you think their ultimate military plan is? Are we going to pull out of Afghanistan and raid Milan… in time for fashion week? Is everyone going to be forced to have gay sex in boot camp? While wearing fatigues by Anna Sui? Will hand-to-hand combat be choreographed a la West Side Story? Will jazz hands be the new water boarding? WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN NOW? What is the homosexual military agenda? HELP ME UNDERSTAND!

The Afternoon Inquisition (or AI) is a question posed to you, the Skepchick community. Look for it to appear Tuesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays, and Sundays at 3pm ET.

Elyse

Elyse MoFo Anders is the bad ass behind forming the Women Thinking, inc and the superhero who launched the Hug Me! I'm Vaccinated campaign as well as podcaster emeritus, writer, slacktivist extraordinaire, cancer survivor and sometimes runs marathons for charity. You probably think she's awesome so you follow her on twitter.

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52 Comments

  1. @Elyse
    Now we will be in an Orwellian world where we will be forced to watch gay porn, and they will torture us until we love gay sex.

    …Or at least that is what I think the GOP vision of the world is.

  2. The military Gay Agenda:

    1. Stop worrying about sexuality ending career.
    2. Deal with some freak-outs by homophobes.
    3. Continue to be willing to risk life for country.
    4. Keep doing job despite increase in panic-y sounding homophobic “teasing”.

    The military Conservative Agenda:

    1. PANIC!
    2. Question own sexuality, leading to:
    3. Fear TEH GAY!
    4. When gays fail to meet expectations of degrading military cohesion, desperately try to “make it true” by degrading that cohesion themselves.
    5. Continue to mistake sexuality for masculinity, despite all evidence to the contrary.
    6. Generally make nuisance of themselves.

    Maybe there should be a DADT style restriction of conservative ideology in the military. I mean, after all, that really is a choice… isn’t it?

  3. From convervapedia’s entry on the homosexual agenda:

    Focus on the Family provides additional quotes from After the Ball, outlining key points of the homosexual agenda:[9][11]

    1. “Talk about gays and gayness as loudly and as often as possible.”
    2. “Portray gays as victims, not as aggressive challengers.”
    3. “Give homosexual protectors a just cause.”
    4. “Make gays look good.”
    5. “Make the victimizers look bad.”
    6. “Get funds from corporate America.”

    This smells of truthiness to me. Someone needs to stop these monsters from talking about gayness as loudly and often as possible.

  4. OOoohhh, this too good to resist. I love this agenda.

    I imagine a branch of the armed services dedicated to one-on-one communication with enemy. No longer will we have to torture or humiliate prisoners during interrogation, just make them learn all the steps to a Fosse musical.

    No longer will we have to chant ” THE WHOLE WORLD IS WATCHING !!! “, cos they will be watching ..our Boys and Girls as they advance under blaring speakers, declaring ” I Will Survive ” .. even the Taliban have feelings , let’s USE that to our glorious advantage.

    Was it not General Lewis at Gettysburg who said ” Give ’em the cold steel, boys ! “.. well I say ..” Give them the BLUE steel, boys. “.. CHARGE.. it @ Rainbowdepot.com . yaaaay !!!

  5. Oh my. I never thought I’d be in this position but sadly the duty has fallen upon me to be the killer of joy on a Skepchick thread.

    Can we all PLEASE stop the lazy stereotyping of gay people? Every time I see people making comments along the lines of how gay men are all fabulously dressed and obsessed with either camp disco tragedy or musical theatre, it’s actually just another means to belittle LGBT folk because what it’s really saying is “Look how shallow and superficial the gays are.”

    I know it’s done for fun and mostly it’s harmless but nothing depressed me more as a teenager than reading those terrible cliches trotted out again and again and it’s kind of sad to see the skeptic community doing it too (the number of people who earlier this year thought it was hilarious to say “Maybe we should call you the FABULOUS Randi” was so insulting that I could have wept.

    Stereotypes based upon sexuality are just as pernicious as those based on race, gender or class. Can we please get over them and stop pandering to the kind of caricatures the religious right try to endlessly uphold.

  6. At the risk of being serious for a moment, there are far more soldiers coming from states with religious inclinations against teh gay. Looking long term this decision might well pave the way for a change in attitude.

    I mean, when you train with a guy, eat, sleep, and generally risk your life day after day with a guy it’s kinda hard to think of him as an evil bastard bent on imposing a horrible gay agenda.

    Also pink tanks.

  7. That may be true but if you replaced the word “gay” with any other minority group, you might start to see things the way I do. It’s not funny, it’s just insulting and pandering to ridiculous and outdated stereotypes I had hoped died out in the 70’s

  8. @Bemmie:

    I understand your feelings, but I think you’re misinterpreting this.

    The point of my post is to respond to ridiculousness with even more ridiculousness. We’re not saying these things because we believe them; we’re mocking the fact that DADT detractors do. I think if you looked around a bit, you’d see that Skepchick takes equality very seriously.

    As for changing his name to “Fabulous Randi”, come on… really? That’s not funny for so many reasons, and homophobia is the least of them.

  9. @ Elyse

    Yes, you’re probably right and I’m almost certainly being overly sensitive in this area. I love Skepchick and I absolutely understand the fact that you take an equal and fair attitude towards us gay folks – but sometimes it seems as if we’re an easy target for cheap jokes and I’m kind of sick of hackneyed cliches, especially as I have no idea of fashion or any of the designer brands you mention, nor do any other gay guys I know.

    I think we deserve a bit better than go-to-guys for humour because when I was a teen it was that exact brand of comdey which made me feel even more isolated.

  10. @Bemmie does have a point, in that “ironic” sexism/racism/homophobia is regarded in some circles as just another means of perpetuating harmful stereotypes (with the added benefit of plausible deniability).

    That said, I’m willing to have a sense of humour about anything, even if the usual gay stereotypes are just as tiresome and overplayed as all the other ones we’ve come to know and love.

  11. @DiscordianStooge: It seems the primary effect of the bill* is to remove Title 10, Subtitle A, Part II, Chapter 37, Section 654: “Policy concerning homosexuality in the armed forces” from the U.S. Code. (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/10/654.html)

    They’re basically removing the section of federal law that says, “You get kicked outta the military if you: (1)have, or try to have, gay sex, (2) state that you’re gay or bisexual, and/or (3) you marry, or try to marry, someone of the same biological sex.”

    To my untrained eyes, it would seem that the bill is removing the prohibition from federal law and leaving it up to the military to implement policies to deal with the new reality of having openly gay service members.

    *Da bill: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:S4023:

  12. I thought the basic idea for the segregation of showers (and toilets) was that one should be able to take a shower without being exposed to people who might have sexual interest in them. So, are gay people going to use the showers and locker rooms for women? I know it was theoretically already problematic during DADT. Or should the military scrap the whole male/female shower segregation? That would obviously reduce costs. I doubt that though, since the military seem to be already afraid of sexual harassment issues. See e.g. what Catherine Aspy wrote about her boot camp:

    “They [the Army] were so scared of sexual harassment that women weren’t allowed to go anywhere without another woman along. They called them ‘Battle Buddies.’ It was crazy. I was twenty-six years old but I couldn’t go to the bathroom by myself.”

    So, which shower and loo should gay men use?

    Similarly, although it does not particularly regard the military: should homosexual security people do tap searches [or whatever it is called in English] on the opposite sex?

  13. The ‘Battle Buddy’ system applies to both sexes. I was 42 and I couldn’t go to the latrine by myself.

    But it’s meant to get soldiers accustomed to the realities of the modern battlefield were wandering off on your own is a no-no.

  14. I was halfway down the thread and already mentally drafting the comment Bemmie left when I came cross eir contribution.

    I’m gay, and I only ever hear gay people talk about and use these stereotypes in safe spaces – usually in private where everyone knows everyone else very well. I don’t think Skepchick qualifies as such a space since I don’t know the community; I just read the updates. I’m a little weirded out, actually. Those stereotypes aren’t very nice, and the intended irony does not come through clearly.

  15. I thought the irony that was being encouraged was implicit in the question, by the way Elyse asked it. And that what was being made fun of was the stereotypical attitudes of those who fought so hard to keep DADT in.

    Hey, I could be wrong, it happened once before.

  16. @AstroCJ:

    I’m a little weirded out, actually. Those stereotypes aren’t very nice, and the intended irony does not come through clearly.

    That’s always the danger, isn’t it? Its kind of like trying to have a philosophical discussion over Twitter.

    To my queer eye, ironic use of gay stereotypes works better in media such as Video or audio, where there’s no need for emoticons or other contrivances to indicate that you’re not speaking literally.

    That said, mockery is one of the most powerful weapons we have against willful stupidity and the more mockery the better.

    Mock away, Elyse – just make sure its worthy of our overlord, Lady Gaga.

    -S

  17. @JoanneBB: There’s a fox “news” poll (surprise), if anyone wants… http://www.foxnews.com/opiniUnsuprisingly the poll is broken. The obvious answer to the question “Will Ending ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell’ Affect America’s Ability to Defend Itself?” is hell yes it will. It will get BETTER. The US will stop kicking perfectly good soldiers out for no reason, and furthermore those who refused to live a lie to serve will start joining up.

  18. @daedalus2u: Sorry I ment the poll was broken in the answers it offered. To the question they ask the answers available are (paraphrasing) “Nothing changes” “It makes the millitary worse” and “I’m not sure, but we shouldn’t mess with stuff while we are at war”

    edit: Aparently I screwed up my link somewhere along the line. Serves me right for trying to be fancy

  19. Well if the gays are anything like the ones I served with I assume that their agenda is something along the lines of most peoples agenda when they volunteer to wear the uniform. They love their country, or they need a way to pay for college or graduate school, or pay off loans, or they are sitting around bored and want something else to do or all of these.

    If you are willing to put on the uniform and serve then you deserve respect. Which means you don’t have to hide.

  20. @Nador:
    Ummm, at least on an aircraft carrier, the showers and toilets are all individual, with the exception of in the brig, there was a toilet in the middle of the room for punishment.
    The only time I ever saw group showers was in boot camp. Even there, the toilets were separated by walls.

    Getting rid of DADT will be good for one thing- guys always used the “I’m gay” card to quit the military with no repercussions…

    ^^^ By that, I don’t mean I am not in favor- its about effin time, it can now become a non-issue what one’s orientation happens to be…

    @Rebel 16:
    @YuiDaoren: COTW
    seconded

  21. @Sean: It isn’t even always a question of whether the irony is clear or not, but whether even ironic perpetuation of some stereotypes is harmful in so much as it continues to keep them alive in the cultural discourse and/or triggers memories of less pleasant experiences in members of the target group (as we have seen here).

    Let’s propose two analogous historical situations and see if the irony is as funny…

    1948: But the real question is, where is Truman going to get all that fried chicken?

    1977: And those few enemies that survive run-ins with our new jeep drivers can just be nagged to death!

    If I’ve learned anything from reading in the feminist blogosphere, it’s that when members of a traditionally oppressed group are made uncomfortable by a joke at their expense, “oh, you just don’t understand the joke” is usually not the right answer.

    I think it’s very important that nothing be off-limits when it comes to humour (and for that reason I’m nearly always on the receiving end of this sort of criticism), but the internet is just so jammed with this kind of facile stereotyping every time an important LGBT story is in the news it would be a nice change of pace just to get some fresh material.

  22. What will happen?
    Absolutely nothing, until the Fundies decide to create some “incidents” to “prove” that they were correct in fighting it. Watch for it. I’m fairly certain this will happen.

    These folks are not above cheating and lying for their beliefs.

  23. @Nador: Separate facilities do not seem likely. According to the “Support Plan for Implementation – Report of the Comprehensive Review of the Issues Associated with the Repeal of ‘Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell'”, published on Nov. 30 by the Department of Defense:

    “The Working Group recommends that the Department of Defense prohibit the creation of separate bathroom and shower facilities based on sexual orientation. Besides being logistically impractical, ‘separate but equal’ facilities would wrongly isolate and stigmatize some Service members. Consistent with the military mission, commanders retain their authority to alter berthing or billeting assignments and may accommodate privacy concerns of individuals on a case-by-case basis.”

  24. 2 things, 1. it’s about damn time.
    2. I wonder if conservapedia was calling Joe Lieberman “liberal” back when he supported John McCain. I find it entertaining how quickly someone can get branded that just for supporting something certain conservatives don’t like. Bet David Frum is also a “liberal” for the same reason (that and he’s Canadian :P)

  25. @delictuscoeli:

    I know you understand the joke. And I understand your objection. However, I believe that mocking bigotry is a way to help bring it down.

    I don’t think you’re being “too sensitive”. And I don’t think you “don’t understand the joke”. I appreciate that you don’t think it’s funny and I respect that… and we do have the same goals. I think we disagree on tactics.

  26. Funny post! Hilarious actually. I do have a gay friend in the (Canadian) Navy – I’m not sure if he’s out. He probably is, this is Canada after all. When I asked him what he does on his ship he told me he’s a watch captain (or something like that). His post is on the bridge and he makes sure the captain’s orders are executed. No mention of the other sailors “being distracted” wondering whether he’s actually hitting on them or something. It just doesn’t come up. Could it be I live in a land of rainbows and unicorns where being gay is simply not an issue? I’d like to think so.

  27. Obviously they will be forcing themselves on all the other guys in their units, one by one. Dozens of healthy, strong, trained-to-kill soldiers, each cowering in fear lest they be the next victim of The Homosexual!

    Or not, just possibly.

  28. The impression that gays are out to sex everyone they meet is also a terrible stereotype. A man can be happily married and committed to his wife and look at another woman and say “Oh she’s pretty” and that’s it, but a gay man will just surprise buttsecks every other man he meet? Absurd. Glad to see they’re doing something about it, though still not enough in the rights department.

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